Have your say
Just click on the comment tag under each post to share your views. All comments will be published unless they contain anything of a personally offensive nature.
Just click on the comment tag under each post to share your views. All comments will be published unless they contain anything of a personally offensive nature.
December 3rd, 2007 at 9:19 am
I cannot see the justification for taking away a public space for use by a minority that is already catered for in numerous sites around the capital. The whole point of common land is that it is for people in common - not just people wanting to play football in the rain.
December 3rd, 2007 at 10:18 am
This scheme is so very poorly thought out, without consideration of the needs of the local community or knowledge about how this space is currently used.
If anyone is to go out onto the triangle any weekend, or any day during the holidays they will see it is full of people from all walks of life, getting on together and in their own groups in a wide variety of spontaneous and community-developing activities: games of frisbee, cricket, football, rounders, picnics, children’s running races, family and group get togethers.
It is an invaluable space because it is one of the very few that is not flanked on any side by a busy road, and vision over the whole space is excellent. This means that younger children can be given the space and freedom to run and run, under a distant but watchful parental eye, without constantly having to be brought back close to the inhibiting side of the parent.
It is a space that gives people a chance to relax in the open air, without being overlooked by houses, or roads, or sports arenas.
It is a space that may can enjoy as a back garden when they do not have such a facility in their own home.
It gives people a chance to have unstructured, uninstitutionalised free space and time, to take exercise outside any form of sports regime.
What on earth is the advantage of 10-12 football pitches over that? How many people just want to play football?, or other pitch sports.
What is the point of covering over even more green space with concrete at a time when we are already aware of the dangers of removing seep away space for flood reasons?
Who did they ask about this plan before putting the wheels in motion?
December 3rd, 2007 at 3:38 pm
I have for the past 4 years walked the Tooting Triangle at least 320 days out of 365 each year. When I first started walking this area I was struck by how few people used it. However I soon realised that I had been deceived by its quiet and security (there are no cars and only a few cyclists thanks to the
No Cycling policy). Strangely the many trains do not intrude on the solitude of this area which is unique because it is cut off from the hurly burly outside.
If you bother to go and sit for half an hour you will find that it is not empty but full of people. They come in their thousands; with dogs; with push chairs and children; with Walkman and jogging shoes; with a bat, a ball and the kids; with their shopping. They never stay long, 10-30 minutes is the usual but they come at every period of the day even into the early hours of the night. When I walk my dog, who wants to make friends with everyone, I stop and talk to at least a dozen strangers per a day. There are a few people I meet on a regular basis but seldom more than one or two per a day.
When I walked the other side of the common, from Franciscan Road, I enjoyed it and was impressed by its quality and diversity. However since moving I have realised that in this Triangle we have something special. I doubt that it is frequented by more people than the other parts of the common but if you were to do a count of the people using it, there would be at least as many as any of the other areas. What is different is that people TALK. On the other side of the common, people would say hullo but walk on. Here they will stop and converse. In this I am not unusual as it is not me that is the catalyst. I will often come up on a group of people taking and as I eavesdrop on their conversation it is clear that in the main they are strangers. No where else do you get this on the Commond and it is exceptionally rare in London.
Moving on I am a Chartered Surveyor, a Fellow with over 40 years experience of all types of property. It was with some interest I read in my Chartered Surveyor about a small piece of research that the RICS has recently sponsored. The effects on Land values - particularly residential - of adjacent parks and open spaces. The general gist of this research was that these spaces increase the land values around them by between 0-20% dependant on how far you are from the space. Even more interesting the researchers indicated that the less developed the land was in the open space the greater the likely increase it would exert.
At the moment this space has one floodlit five a side football pitch along side the primary school. In all the years that I have been walking this area I have only seen it used twice. Before developing this area we need to be very sure that there is a demand for these facilities.
Lastly I am a great admirer of Margaret Thatcher but she did make mistakes and one of them which few would now deny is that she sold off the school playing fields. We cannot now reverse this mistake as the land has been changed irreversibly. Yes, if you spent hundreds of thousands of pounds, it could be reversed but we all know that will not happen. The same is true of this triangle. Once developed it is gone forever. The Victorians in their wisdom gave us something very precious, something other cities around the world envy us for. It would be truely stupid to squander it for a little short term gain. We will not be able to get it back.
Julian Colledge FRICS
December 3rd, 2007 at 9:54 pm
I agree with the comments that I have read above. I have lived in the SW12/17 area for 18 years and have been to Tooting Common on an almost daily basis to walk the dog, go running or to walk with the family. I love the natural environment that I find there. It is a pleasure to observe the seasonal changes, the common is very well maintained and it feels safe. It is one of the highlights of living in this part of London.
The One O’clock Club and the playground have been valuable to us over the years and our children have played football on saturday mornings at the Triangle. I have also enjoyed watching frisby games, seeing people relax with barbeques, gatherings and finding a calm place in the buzz of city life. Tooting Common is unique and we as residents value it very much.
I urge the Council to reconsider based on the impact this project will have on the local community. I find it hard to believe that people will not try to come by car and impossible to believe that the volume of people this facility will attract will not have a massive impact on local residents.
December 4th, 2007 at 10:27 am
On a practical note, I believe this matter is to be discussed at the Tooting Bec Management Advisory Committee on 10th December. If anyone on this blog knows, could you please say where and at what time that is?
December 4th, 2007 at 1:01 pm
I am really upset that a proposal for 10 to 15 five aside commercial football pitches could be so smoothly making its way with my council and yet no one in my road - Rossiter Road SW12 - seems to have heard anything about it.
I have lived in Balham since 1985 and Tooting common is our only public outdoor resource. The children’s playground and the 1 o’clock club have saved the sanity of many a mother (and father) of young children. Being a mother can be lonely and stressful, and the playground and club are the lynchpin of many a parent’s day, providing companionship and play for the parent and child. It is hard to understand the reasoning of taking away a much used family resource in order to build 10 - 15 all weather, arc-lit, 5 aside football pitches for young men (the ones who have the money to pay).
The council say that this development fulfills the need “to make a provision for ‘youth’” but exactly who do they have in mind - what schools will the youth come from, etc. There are already a number of areas where football is played on the common and on other commons throughout Wandsworth without having to ‘develop’ /destroy a much used existing amenity.
Environmentally, the Five Aside proposal is without any merit and is actually destructive of a small wildlife area, full of birds. It is easy to imagine the damage that would be done during construction and then afterwards one would be left with large, locked, high-fenced, all weather surfaced courts, lit with arc lights at night. There would have to be a booking office - the courts will not be free - and it would all be garish and of no use to us Wansdworth citizens.
I see no need to develop the area at all excet to plant some more trees and wildlife friendly plants.
December 4th, 2007 at 2:11 pm
I agree wholeheartedly with the views expressed above about how unique
Tooting Triangle is. There is a real sense of peace and calm in the Triangle and the trains add a gentle intermittent noise rather than the frantic consistent roar of the traffic elsewhere on Tooting Common.
It is a lovely place to be at any time of day because it is so peaceful.
I am not sure the council have taken on board that Tooting Common is completely taken over by organised and impromptu games of football particularly at the week-ends and espcially when the weather is fine. You are unable to walk anywhere on the common and you see young people and young families pushed to the edges of the common as there is little space left for anyone else.
There are cars parked everywhere along both sides of Dr. Johnson’s Avenue all up and down the local residential roads and the car parks are completely full.
Why then do we need more football pitches?
The Triangle is rarely used by footballers because of its inaccessability. The surrounding roads are very crowded and local residents find it diffuclt to park. It is hard to drive around and access the area at the best of times as the roads are narrow.
The council say that shool minibusses and coaches will deliver the players to the site and then move on and park elsewhere. Where exactly?
I am not sure this has been properly thought through.
It is hard to pass another car let alone a coach or minibus or two minibusses in the surrouding streets.
There is not enough parking space for the local residents let alone to cope with the influx of hundreds of football players and coming and going. See Dr. Johnson Avenue at the week end and that is similar situation you would be dealing with on a daily basis until 11.30 at night.
Another council thought was that most people would come by public transport?
If the Council feel that the Triangle needs a bit of a face lift then fine, tidy it up and sort out the rat problems. Otherwise please leave it as it is.
The current football pitch would be fine with a little maintainence.
The council want to generate income and will not pay a penny for this development.
Perhaps they should be lobbying for more equal Government support which is given to other boroughs but denied to Wandsworth.
How many other prospective sites have been looked at as possible alternatives?
December 4th, 2007 at 2:11 pm
I would like to register my details to object against the proposed development of this area of the common. I’m on the common every day with my son and dog and I feel it will impact negatively on the local area.
Please use the money on improving local school facilities.
December 8th, 2007 at 7:06 pm
I am concerned about the impact of traffic and parking. I live in the Abbotswood/ Hoadly triangle where at the moment there are no parking restrictions , ideal for teams to park for free. Lambeth council have proposed parking permits in the past, this would be an ideal excuse. The consequences are even more front gardens paved over to be used as off road parking.